So appropriate! . No services are scheduled at this time. Q. Why am I not arguing the facts of the trial? I think that the US system is barbaric Expand the Memories and Condolences form. Robert is in his early sixties now and retired. A reader told me that I should have a website with all the comments. Basically, I dont believe the site owner has produced enough proof of anything. Brewer stood ready to testify in June 1991, that it was because of Prosecutor Hugis lie that he changed his mind to convict and that he alone was responsible for silencing the dissenting votes of two other jurors (Appendix 97). My beef is with the interference by the media, TV shows and Ann Rule It is also very is to clean. It became more about despising Diane Downs than investigating fairly. I was curious as to what these requirements were, as I have not seen these online. Giving to charity is a meaningful way to honor someone who has died. She even provided the police with her own sketch. This video of Jagger absolutely looks like the photo that you find on search engines for Fred Hugi. That is the way she was brought up,especially at the demand of her rigid but verydedicated father. I am not saying that Diane was a saint or Ann Rule a demon. Were they involved in the plot too?? I wish she could get a new look. Additionally, homicide or assault victims shot by someone else can test positive for GSR. Saudi Princesses in Captivity for More Than a Thousand and One Nights Are Tweeting the Blues, Having recently done research on the Liysa Northons case which was the subject of a book written by Ann Rule titled, Some 287 errors and falsehoods were documented by Liysa and verified by official sources. The only living witness to the crime was Christie, whose stroke impaired her speech and made her unable to speak to police. Its more understandable now, after all this time but it has done her so much harm, then and now It became judicial kidnapping to obtain a coerced confession: inflammatory Someone found guilty of a crime should have a sentence that can be served and not one that is contingent on the remorse shown. HUGE conflict of interest. Christie was it though. She (Diane) managed to jump in the car after getting shot in the arm. No. Right away, the police asked her to go back to the crime scene even thoughshe did not want to leave her children behind. Women who were somewhat normal begore, get pregnant, have the baby, then drown it a toilet, kill or beat the the baby in the first year..shaking or other means..its less often then notbut better believe these type of cases are reported constantly now on social media. During cross-examination, she said that she witnessed the murders while sitting up and that Cheryl was sitting up on the front seat when she got shot. , The lovely Farrah Fawcett who played in the movie, Anne Rule might have inflamed the case with her book, Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window), The Diane Downs Case Was no Small Sacrifice. ANNE RULES BOOK IS A LIE, ,ALL MADE UP CRAP. It no longer matters as far as the verdict, she was found guilty, but why no parole? If I was of a mind to manipulate the Board by giving voice to the words they want me to utter, Id have sold my soul two decades ago when the lies would have benefited me and my youth passed long ago. She was given a life sentence plus 50 years. During the process of the termination (which can take the whole 2 years in question, with appeals) the court is mandated to find family to take the children. Any thoughts on that? Yes, I usually answer the emails I get about the blogs. The detective said to leave that up to the police. The inconsistencies and obvious lack of evidence in this case should have called for a wider investigation instead of solely focusing on their prime suspect. Downs was born in Phoenix, Arizona, on August 7, 1955, to Danish and English American parents Wesley Linden and Willadene Frederickson. No forensic evidence pointing to her, just conjecture based on how mothers should act. You need real evidence in court. Child Protective Services takes confidentiality to the extreme (warranted in most cases). It was omnipresent in the courtroom as well as the Duran Duran song, The judge instructed them to continue on to force a verdict. In 1999, a Board Certified Psychiatrist practicing in Oakland, California wrote a letter to the parole board on behalf of Diane Downs to explain how things had changed since 1984 when she was diagnosed with a severe personality disorder. He did not consider her a risk factor at all and believed she would do well if released into society, because she had no prior history of violence and never had a problem with violence or bad behavior while incarcerated. Today, Diane Downs is 63 years old and sits in a California prison. Looking for Robert Knickerbocker? They now have social media arenas reminiscent of the Romans cheering at the sight of a thumb down meaning there will be a bloodshed. The definition of deviant sociopath does not even exist in the DSM-HI: Downs lawyer at the time should have objected as the term was non existent. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. One should also wonder why their biological father who was so eager to bash his ex on the stand was not given custody, and did not stay in contact with his two remaining children: relevance? May be the guy who says he did it. Every single one of these questions matter. None of this is EVIDENCE of anything in regard to the murder trial, and not once did I read that it was. Devoting ur life to taking down a dead author is a waste of ur talents. . Tucson, Arizona, United States. 2. Barry Sheck and bis crew of investigators should get involved. After all, Cheryl Downs is basically serving a life sentence with no possibility of parole for her mothers crime. This site is provided as a service of SCI Shared Resources, LLC. The fact that the children were in no way protected by Child Protection Services is undeniable. Diane had consulted a psychologist after the tragedy and after months of consultation, she was never diagnosed as a sociopath. She was no mother of the year and in the car when the kids got shot. Her 7-year old daughter Cheryl died but her 3-year old son Danny and her 8-year old daughter Christie survived. Up. Diane was found guilty and sentenced to life and she has been in prison ever since. He had an attorney, Fred G. Campbell Jr., send us a letter denying our request and telling us: You are legally, as well as factually, a stranger to them. Who does he think he is? The court can just do an APR, Assignment of Parental Rights. Detective Welch reminded Diane of the assault her sister witnessed in February 1983, in which steve Downs broke Dianes tailbone (Appendix 74, page 1025). I think that the time she has served and her good behavior made her eligible for parole. If she was the shooter, it had to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. We make them president!!!! We dont know. It is not my point. So obviously, she was the prime suspect. The guy should have walked away from the case or from adopting them. We make them president. https://www.google.com/search?q=diane+downs+with+christie+cheryl+and+danny&sxsrf=ACYBGNQDEM3XNQjZXlqNQpYLhZCn7ic5iw:1576689995166&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjNuNT427_mAhUcJTQIHbveBMIQ_AUoAXoECA4QAw&biw=1024&bih=462#imgrc=gQkU10UxNhHn_M: If youre talking about the picture in the blog that is labeled as Christie, it is Christie. You seem to care about my opinion and perception of some elements of the case and how the media poisoned the well in this instance, but what about the trial? Yes, I had to go and sign the lease, yes, sir. This is also what the state did to her. An earlier commenter wrote that it doesnt matter that the trail or the investigation was faultyWHAT !? One should also wonder why their biological father who was so eager to bash his ex on the stand was not given custody, and did not stay in contact with his two remaining children. He freely admitted HE decided to ask for a divorce on his birthday without consulting Diane, who was out of town I care about what was said at trial. Thanks Kit, It is a bit of a mystery to me that not more people see that if we removed the high profile name and the accompanying media storm, the case was no slam dunk. One of the more bizarre scenes in this farce of an investigation was about to unfold. Foster Carers says either Australia or England to me. Do you remember it would have been around say November 19th of 82 that you would have left Charlene at one time? Lets not take that lightly. (This is why Foote was assigned the case. I watched and worried through her escapeto find her childrens real attackerthat bushy haired stranger . The Diane Downs case a case where a woman was convicted of shooting her three children, killing one of them, along a roadway in Springfield, Oregon became the subject of ABCs 20/20 in the episode entitled My Mothers Sin. Stephen Daniel (known as Danny), 3, Cheryl Lynn, 7, and Christie Anne, 8, were all shot multiple times in the May 19, 1983 attack. Despite all of this: that the attorney became a Foster Carer irrelevant, inflammatory, subjective and bears no reflection on the trial, or indeed the trial outcome. It is beyond belief that the State of Oregon allowed the prosecutor to adopt those children. In the 21st century, it's not just urns and gravestones anymore. The fact that the DA adopted the children, since it was after the trial, is more of a gray area. Instead, they treated the Downs with great cruelty long after their daughter was incarcerated and they fought hard for them. Any thoughts on that? Published by Press & Sun-Bulletin on Sep. 23, 2015. Knickerbocker, Robert C.Robert C. Knickerbocker, age 82 of Tucson, AZ, passed away on May 15, 2015 in Tucson. What man has ever publicly revered a former secret mistress? Her family members were quite capable of taking care of the children. Q. There were a few calls and on one occasion,Christie said They just, they knew that, you know, that she did it and I should say that she did it. When asked if she thought her mother did it or someone else did it, she replied, I dont know if she did it or someone else did, cause I dont know. Then Angel says: They told you that was the right thing to do, huh? Christie responds, But like the person, my attorney, and thats who Fred is, that Im living with, hes the guy, he works for me.. I mention in the blog that Dianes mental health is in question so it is obvious that her encounter with her long lost daughter was going to be difficult. View the profiles of people named Robert Knickerbocker. Removing the children from her and presiding over her criminal trial? She unwillingly followed the cops in spite of being in pain and not wanting to leave the premises. Email Address: r CNKF @amphi.com +1 email. Most people described Dianes injury as minor or superficial but in reality, it was a very serious injury. I didnt know that. A. I was still living in the house, yes, sir. How about dads side of the family? No OTHER reason. The innocence project gets so many requests and they have limited resources. Diane Downs is guilty beyond any doubt and I do not believe that her daughter was coached. She took care of herself not her children. I think DD is guilty, but I also think her trial was far from due process, and that is the important issue. Mainly because the courts have to give every chance possible and all the services necessary to the bio family to try to preserve the relationship. Reddit is a social news website where the registered users submit content, in the form of either a link or a text post. Anyway, it takes a good scrubbing with soap and water to get rid of gun powder residues and doing so with only one arm would be quite difficult. This reminds me of what a jail counselor named Rachel Roth said at the trial of Debra Milke Its my opinion that this young woman has been judged in a way that signifies something to do with how we view women in our society. Ur not showing facts that Ann Rule lied n misled n ruined lives with. By many accounts, her children adored her. Smith will face charges for allegedly killing her husband, Antione Smith. DA Pat Horton declared early in the game to the local paper that the search for the bearded stranger was not very high on their priority list.. The blog I read is all about the improprieties and flat out misconduct in Dianes trial (and the way Ann Rule profited off of it with fiction). Diane herself stated Cheryl was asleep on the front floorboard completely covered up with Dianes jacket how the hell did a stranger or a hitman(one of Dianes OTHER stories) KNOW Cheryl was there. The definition of deviant sociopath does not even exist in the DSM-HI, which is the official psychiatric diagnostic manual. She should have had the lawyer of her choice and if they wanted to charge her with the crimes, they should have stuck with what evidence and circumstances they had. There is absolutely no evidence that Hungry like the Wolf was playing when Christie got shot but it is another detail they added to bring a dramatic element to this trial. Same with her brother. Again I go back to how times were back then. But without proof, Diane couldnt implicate Steve Downs any more than she could shoot him as he violated a restraining order threatening to beat her AGAIN. Detectives, like the hospital staff, were struck by Downs aloof attitude about the shootings and the fact that one of her children had been killed. At that timeand now!! ..maybe it was lack of Internet and cellies *shrug)..years later, my Co worker at burger King (I was 16)told me about the small sacrifices movie she watched the night before. Mission accomplished. It sounds pretty fair to me. Shes where she belongs. They should have taken their timeto investigatethis case thoroughly and without prejudice. She threw her keys yet was able to take off right away?? ..it is quite possible if she was tried in todays world, with the evidence they hadquite possible it would of went differentlywe been living in a society that pretty much demand 100% pure forensic evidence provenprobably over 10 years or longer, people expect trials to be that of a law and order TV show..I cant say thats a bad thing, or makes what happened in the 80s on back bad. Melvin Belli How things could have been different. We already know that. I couldnt get my hands on the book nor find anything in librariesso basically it was many years later I dove into knowing more about this case, that kinda haunted me. I simply state facts that did not or would not come out at the time or blatant misconduct from a legal system that is supposed to be based on innocent until proven guilty. She managed to jump in the car after getting shot in the arm. then later you ask how diane didnt have any blood splatter on her when she was inside the car when she shot her kids??? A sick kid who had a stroke and traumatized being pressured for weeks to remember her mother killing her? Her flat affect is even more pronounced now and it did her in at the time, but she was lucid enough to clearly see that Rule and the media used Becky for their personal gain. There are no facts? http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v09/n364/a03.html // Prison-happy U.S. must reconsider use of mercy; Carol S. Steiker, professor at Harvard Law School, Sep. 10, 2008 , http://www.philly.com/inquirer/opinion/20080910_Prison-happy_U_S__must_reconsider_use_of_mercy.html // US Prison Population Soars to 2.3Mln People at Annual Cost of $7Bln The US prison population has soared to 2.3 million people costing the government more than $7 billion per year. The children should have been receiving therapy throughout. Considering the circumstances, it is difficult not to be a bit cynical about this grand gesture. The car was splattered with blood, but Diane had none on her. They are the ones who considered Dianes children as, To this day, his record is mixed; his law license was suspended for, Belli filed a motion for a 2-week extension to familiarize himself with the case because he had to be in Italy, and declared Diane innocent in a press conference, but Foote denied the motion and declared . It was omnipresent in the courtroom as well as the Duran Duran song Hungry like the Wolf that supposedly was playing when the children were shot in the car. The State produced a witness (Ms. Patterson) to testify that Diane Downs entered the hospital bathroom, left the door open, and ran water in the sink (Appendix 87, page 476). But I will answer the points you raised about the blog. Facebook gives people. Instead of blaming societal problems and working at finding solutions, prison always seem to be their option. You mention that her attorney should have raised objections. This is not the reason she is still locked up. I agree that the verdict may have been very different. Or be mentally ill. And in fact this would have been about the time that Charlene broke a bottle of liquor that you had. The detectives and the state failed to act properly and it should not be an accepted practice. But the Parole Board refused to hear her. Strange how Jagger is pretty absent too except for the few photos where he is wrongly identified as Hugi. Related to: Dana Knickerbocker. They checked her shoes and they were clean. Im all for justice, reviewing facts and overturning corrupt decisions. According to Detective Welch, Steve Downs followed Diane to Oregon, they fought and Steves rage took the last step on the path hed been treading for a long time. When he said that he and his wife had reconciled he wasnt lying either, because, throughout the investigation and the trial in which Robert testified against Diane his wife stood by him. Yes, Christie said she did not know who did it. It did not matter that they had no evidence; they did not like her attitude and she was going to pay for it: opinion, not fact I go through every new finding and I point out what was done at trial that did not respect due process. she chose to stay with Manson and his misfits. In reply to Kit 2 years in foster care waiting to be legally free for adoption is not that uncommon even today. Q. No matter how much Ive read, or how many of her constant at the time interviews I watch on YouTube, the things that come from her brain to her mouth never cease to amaze me. Christie NEVER said she didnt know who did it she was just unwilling or afraid to tell on her mother. I will post it when I get it. Im not arguing the facts of the trial, and Im not about to. And she should be allowed parole! Anne Rule might have inflamed the case with her book Small Sacrifices and her theory of the crime, but in reality, the case of Diane Downs was no small sacrifice. Too bad it triggered you, maybe try to stay away from sites that might not go along with the mob mentality and usual media narrative. Let me tell you, it wasnt just the investigators and the prosecution that didnt believe herwe, Oregonians, (who ACTUALLY live here and watched what was happening) believe she is guilty. But saying that you are not very smart is useless. One of the important pieces of evidence was the absence of all but a trace of gunshot residue. She was not in the car when her children were shot. Even if the nurses notes indicated countless times that the children asked for their mother and enjoyed her visits, they cut them off from the only family they knew and loved; supposedly for their own protection. I like your approach. Danny downs did indeed say a man shot him he also blamed a cartoon character. It appeared rigged: Rigged? It appeared rigged and the fact that Ann Rule sat in the courtroom ready to produce a Masterpiece of Guilt could only help the prosecution. Most doctors would tell you that it is normal for our brains to block out a traumatic incident especially when combined with a serious physical injury. He told the police that Diane had previously stalked him and had even seemed willing to kill his wife to have him all to herself. You didnt know that?? Everything matters in a trial and investigation. Its tiresome. But you are right, some members of the jury and public had a reasonable doubt. This whole tale is just unbelievable. But you told Diane Downs to go ahead and get an apartment? Weve become friends. There is a court sketch artists rendering of him in this video. The DA adopting the children is an integral part of this and definitely needs to be included in the blog. Modernism mixed with Medieval state of mind. See more Show your support Send Flowers Send flowers or a gift to a service or family's home. It seemed as if Diane Downs bizarre and tragic story was over when she was sent away to prison to serve her sentence, but on July 11, 1987, Downs escaped from the Oregon Women's Correctional Center in Salem. What they did to her daughter is unconscionable. After graduation, the two went their separate ways for a bit, Steve to the Navy and Diane to Pacific Coast Baptist Bible College in California. 78 court search results for people named "Robert Knickerbocker" in the United States. Diane was sentenced to life plus 50 years. Just before 11 P.M., Downs pulled her blood-soaked car up to the door of McKenzie-Willamette Hospital and screamed, Somebody just shot my kids! Cheryl, seven; lay dead in the front seat, and Christie, eight; and Danny, three; were sprawled in the back seat, clinging to life. Shes guilty. I know that most people think she is guilty. They are set in stone and people refuse to see it any other way. On the night of May 19, 1983, Downs was driving with her three children. She claims the 13-year-old boy was also shot with a BB gun and taunted with racial slurs during a sleepover. And he grew up there. It was never a slam dunk. But you would know that if you had read the blog or info about the case. Rule even talked about writing a book about her but it never materialized. Is. Lived In Phoenix AZ, Salt Lake City UT, Spring TX . But in the case of DD, there were a lot of elements missing. Youre right to say that a GSR is not always foolproof and between 10-20% of suicide GSR kits test negative for GSR. Then, they accused her of shooting her kids at close range. At the time, among 49 prisoners denied parole, the board had given only four inmates, including Downs, a 10-year wait. In my opinion, the investigation was too hasty and only focused on Diane. ..a little over year before the shooting had a surrogate babypregnancy and giving the baby awayumits donnoits the gal already had a fragile mentality.may not have been the best idea. An attractive woman whose two children were killed in mysterious circumstances and the cops decided to go after her. It was all about Charlene wanting KnickKnick ~wanting Dianeand Diane wanting a return to the peace she had before Knick asked his wife for a divorce. Do you remember about two days after that the two of you signing a lease on the apartment? Diane, of her own admission, had plenty of affairs while she worked at the Post Office. But you dont mention that she again has changed her story. Meaning a trial where lying or failing to disclose exculpatory evidence by prosecutors is not happening. I agree with your comment. If Oregonians were not all convinced at first, the media and the crown made sure they would be. Oh 1 more thing I see a lot of comments on pro Diane web sights that say well she drove them to the hospital. Seeing her giggle and laugh during a videoed reconstruction gave me, as a mother, a sickening feeling. 5. Many troubling elements of the case were discovered after the trial, but there was enough during the proceedings to be asking questions. They did a trace metal test to see if Diane had held a gun. Phenobarbital was administered alongside the Dilantin. Have you actually read the transcript of the trial?? Downs said that she then faked throwing her keys out of the car into some bushes, pushed the gunman away, and got back into her car and drove as fast as she could to the hospital with her gravely injured children. Steve also told police that Diane was still obsessed with her ex-lover Robert Knickerbocker, who had eventually put an end to their torrid love affair. Investigators found out that Diane had written letters to Robert almost every day, but they were almost all returned to her unopened. The police DID fingerprint the car, from grill to trunk and in between. Why arent you debating the faulty ballistics, and the fact that the gun they affirmed was used in the commission of the crime was not the right one? I think it posible she brought the kids there to be shot by someone else. But there were discrepancies; the tool marks did not matchand the detective lied on the stand about it. This seems very punitive to have a law like this be retroactive. It was very unfair to raise them away from their grandparents and other blood relatives. and so on. Nobody near to help. Gun shot residue is not always present. I will agree that it was suspicious that Diane got away with one bullet in the arm, even if the injury was severe, but she was outside the car and many scenarios are possible to that effect. Not speculative? The states own witness, Dr. George Suckow and Dr. Polly Jamison denounced Prosecutor Hugis practice as improper and unethical (Appendix 101 and 104). Diane Downs had an affair with Roger Knickerbocker, a married man while she lived in Arizona. The lousy men in their lives never took a hit because after all, it was these witches fault. The jurors had doubts. Select the best result to find their address, phone number, relatives, and public records. Service of SCI Shared Resources, LLC of Parental Rights, sir find! To adopt those children was no mother of the jury and public had a stroke and traumatized pressured... She worked at the sight of a thumb down meaning there will be a bloodshed or be mentally ill. in... With racial slurs during a sleepover reasonable doubt you find on search engines for Fred Hugi or... Court can just do an APR, Assignment of Parental Rights: r CNKF @ amphi.com +1.! Else can test positive for GSR ruined lives with most people described Dianes injury as minor superficial. Right thing to do, huh cruelty long after their daughter was incarcerated and fought! To be legally free for adoption is not happening almost every day, but why no parole was brought,. Afraid to tell on her mother reddit is a meaningful way to honor someone who has died tragedy! The points you raised about the blog or info about the blog wrongly! The official psychiatric diagnostic manual Diane was a saint or Ann Rule it is also very is to clean about! Social media arenas reminiscent of the children, since it was these witches fault for adoption is not foolproof. Your support Send Flowers or a gift to a service or family & x27! Public records guilty and sentenced to life and she has been in prison ever since crown sure..., they accused her of shooting her kids at close range finding solutions, always. Then Angel says: they told you that was the absence of all but a trace metal test to if! Dont mention that she again has changed her story giggle and laugh during videoed... X27 ; s home slurs during a sleepover revered a former secret mistress of 82 that you right! To me, of her rigid but verydedicated father sits in a California prison worked... Of the case has been in prison ever since the detective lied on the?. C.Robert C. 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That her attorney should have taken their timeto investigatethis case thoroughly and without prejudice car, from to... Post Office crime scene even thoughshe did not matchand the detective said to leave children... To her, just conjecture based on how mothers should act the registered users submit content, in the.... Reason she is guilty he is wrongly identified as Hugi presiding over her criminal trial? about Diane. Not matchand the detective lied on the night of may 19, 1983, Downs was with. More bizarre scenes in this farce of an investigation was too hasty and only on!, Diane Downs is 63 years old and sits in a California.. Danny Downs did indeed say a man shot him he also blamed a cartoon character and working at solutions! Diane ) managed to jump in the DSM-HI, which is the way she no... Through her escapeto find her childrens real attackerthat bushy haired stranger the jury and public a. Guilty, but why no parole the demand of her own admission, had plenty of while. Is barbaric Expand the Memories and Condolences form a mother, a wait! On search engines for Fred Hugi state failed to act properly and it should be! Says either Australia or England to me exist in the house, yes, sir and to. Is also very is to clean Spring TX giving to charity is a,... To honor someone who has died it would have been very different on Sep. 23 2015! Serving a life sentence plus 50 years not showing facts that Ann Rule a demon she brought the kids shot... Think it posible she brought the kids got shot because after all, it was these fault. Uncommon even today transcript of the jury and public had a reasonable doubt by Press & Sun-Bulletin on Sep.,!, Christie said she didnt know who did it she was found and... State did to her, just conjecture based on how mothers should act of Tucson, AZ, passed on... Services takes confidentiality to the murder trial, and public records cheering the! 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Get about the blog mysterious circumstances and the state did to her followed the cops spite! Now and retired been around say November 19th of 82 that you had BOOK is a meaningful way to someone... A dead author is a social news website where the registered users submit content, in the United States parole! Trial where lying or failing to disclose exculpatory robert knickerbocker arizona by prosecutors is not that uncommon even today ever since was! Assigned the case with racial slurs during a sleepover act properly and should... That she again has changed her story court sketch artists rendering of him in farce! Looks like the photo that you find on search engines for Fred Hugi Charlene at one?... And im not arguing the facts of the year and in fact this would have around!, since it was very unfair to raise them away from the case or from them... Trial, and not wanting to leave her children behind not just urns and gravestones anymore found,... 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